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Jeremy Wickins's avatar

Another great episode, Dusty - thank you! If you haven't seen it, there is an excellent article by Janice Turner in the Times, about Gisèle Pélicot and how her case is important for France. One horrifying takeaway is that some or all of the men could walk away free, because the definition of rape requires force. Read it and weep (I did). https://www.thetimes.com/article/5deef277-12a8-41da-98ab-5ff283a6d6f6?shareToken=ac2265ecf6a156d63be77cc06597b300

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

You're welcome, Jeremy and thanks, I shall read Janice's piece.

Dusty

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Liz Parker's avatar

If someone is drugged , they cannot give consent, therefore it’s forced, surely.

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

Here's hoping, Liz!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Jeremy Wickins's avatar

From the article I sent, it seems that not struggling is taken as consent (don't shout at me, I'm as appalled as anyone!) It seems that this may be behind the drugging, alongside a regressive "his house, his bed, his wife" attitude that deems able to give proxy consent for their wives. I am sickened by what I learned from Janice's excellent article, to be honest.

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

Dreadful case!!! As you say, sickening!

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Tenaciously Terfin's avatar

Sorry Jeremy, we aren’t shouting at you. 😄

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

😀

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Jeremy Wickins's avatar

I know, but thank you. ❤️

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Jeremy Wickins's avatar

Another one up at daft-o-clock, TT!

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Tenaciously Terfin's avatar

That’s awful. Surely they must be able to prosecute somehow!

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

Sounds appalling but I’m not a criminal law expert. Jeremy?

Some kind of assault?

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Jeremy Wickins's avatar

My knowledge of French law is negligible - I'm only going on what I see reported in English media. I would certainly hope there is an alternative charge that can be brought, but I don't know.

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

OK thanks, Jeremy.

Let's hope so!

Dusty

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Barbara G's avatar

Re the Allison Bailey case, just looked up section 111 of EA 2010 and I can see what they mean:

“111Instructing, causing or inducing contraventions

(1)A person (A) must not instruct another (B) to do in relation to a third person (C) anything which contravenes Part 3, 4, 5, 6 or 7 or section 108(1) or (2) or 112(1) (a basic contravention).

(2)A person (A) must not cause another (B) to do in relation to a third person (C) anything which is a basic contravention.

(3)A person (A) must not induce another (B) to do in relation to a third person (C) anything which is a basic contravention.

(4)For the purposes of subsection (3), inducement may be direct or indirect.”

I’m feeling hopeful (but why wasn’t this taken into account in the earlier cases?)

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

Hi Barbara

Yes it's a wholly new point. I am not sure but I presume it was not quite as obvious as it was in this case in other cases The time line here is that Stonewall complained about Allison to Garden Court and then GC took the matter forward. GC then claimed that they, as it were, proceeding under their own steam but the link does seem very obvious on the face of it.

The greater significance is that, if this is successful, it will apply to Stonewall (and others) in many other cases.

Fingers crossed!!!!

Dusty

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

Sorry the other aspect was that Stonewall claimed that the employee who contacted GC ( the one with the support dog!!) was acting under her own steam - that always sounded like a bit of a lame excuse!

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Tenaciously Terfin's avatar

Thanks Dusty, great work as ever. 500 updates, wow! I’ll get the bubbly chilled. 🥂

The more I read about the Supreme Court shenanigans, the more I can understand the hilarity from listeners.

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Dusty Masterson's avatar

You’re welcome, TT.

The great thing about the overflow Court was that all of us Terfs could feel free to treat the Scottish Government case with the derision it deserved 😊

Trying to take notes while people are roaring with laughter is difficult 😂

Dusty

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